We know that if you put your hand on our lower back and lead us somewhere, that is the signal to let us know you want to put your hands on other parts of our body, too. And, unless you're a creep, we're usually cool with that. We know that when you touch our face, it's you trying to be "tender" with us when all you really want is to kiss. And that's usually cool too, if you've treated us kindly and with respect and there's a genuine connection there. "Leading a woman away from the pack"? Please. So elementary. Trust me, we didn't GO to that party/bar/club/FHE meeting to hang out with the girlfriends we arrived with. In fact, ask ANY woman you know if she'd prefer to stay talking with her roommates or a man who showed interest in something she's talking about. Or even a man who showed interest in anything long enough to look her in the eye and give a few meaningful responses or contributions beyond the typical "good to see you (as I look over your shoulder at every other girl in the room)" move men tend to think inspires us to like you.
Besides. If you're taking advice from a man who looks like this:
I think we need more help than you can find in some $35 book.What baffles me is that men seem to think it's so COMPLICATED to get a woman's affections. If anything, that is the ONE area where women are incredibly simple. All a woman needs is to know you are sincere. Genuine interest, sincere attention, and TIME are all it really takes. And trust me, boys, not one of you (that I know) needs more help than that. I'm amazed at how many guys will say, "Why aren't you interested in (this guy or that guy)?" and the only response I can give is, "He never asked." If you are a man and you're not ASKING for us to give you attention, you're likely only going to get it from girls who still think baking brownies is the best way to the alter. Which is fine, if that's what you're looking for. (Just know that I'm rolling my eyes and snickering.) But if what you want is a mature, equal partner who is ready to get into the trenches with you because she wants to contribute to creating the best life you can together, all you need to do is ASK.
Ask for her attention by talking to her when she's not surrounded by other people. Ask her opinion on something that interests you- ask her about what interests HER. Ask her out- show her you think she's worth an hour or two of your Guitar Hero time. And here's the real kicker- if you're asking her sincerely about what you genuinely want to learn about her, and she's INTERESTING to you, chances are high, she'll think YOU are really interesting, too. It's a crazy pheonomenon- people who are interestING are so because they are interestED. And what's awesome for you (for both of you) in this deal, is that when you do find someone genuinely interesting, you don't have to think about "moves" or "tactics" because she'll already know you're interested. And the bonus is: You really are.
In fact, as a woman who'd like to see everyone feel good in a relationship, let me offer you some of MY pickup artist tips (and they're totally free):
1) Be genuine. It's hard to take someone seriously when you know he's said the same things to every girl you know.
2) Be real. Don't kiss us when you don't like us and don't want to see us again. THAT is how guys get labeled as players. NOT by asking out multiple girls in order to get to know individuals better.
3) Be good. You would not BELIEVE how many referrals I get on a guy I barely even know- word on the street is, "he's a really good guy." INTERESTING how "really good guy" equates to "damn! I REALLY want him to call me!"
So please, Really Good Guys of this world, know this: We like you. We want you. We just need you to want us enough to reach out and let us know that you're interested enough to put down that stupid book and give us a little of your time.
Anything else you'd like to contribute in the advice sector for these guys? Go for it. If my buddies are wasting $35 on this scam artist, I can promise any words of wisdom are welcome here.
25 comments:
I'll admit that I watched an episode or two of that dude's show. It was funny, in a sad sort of way (for both the guys and the girls involved). The saddest part to me was that his approach is basically about how to be a more efficient jerk, from what I could see. I don't doubt that what the guy says in his book works, even if it does come from a dude wearing eye liner.
Anyway, I think far too much thought goes into how to play "the game." Just make an effort to always be your best self, be genuine, and go out there and play the hand of cards life deals you. Sooner or later you're bound to meet someone you click with. What's so complicated about that?
And on another note, I've noticed that there's a recurring hypothetical girl "who still think(s) baking brownies is the best way to the alter" that turns up in your posts from time to time in some incarnation or another. Do you really know girls who really take that tack? Thinking back to my BYU days (which is where you would intuitively expect to find the highest concentrations of such hypothetical women), and I don't remember meeting any. Do you really know girls like that, or are you just playing to stereotypes?
uh...yeah. I DO know girls like that.
And to those brownie-sluts:
I am the one who eats his brownies.
A lot of guys need help- this guy would not be my go to guy.
I think everyone needs a dating coach of the opposite sex, someone that is emotionally removed from the situation and can give candid honest advice-
guys who wear binoculars as fashion accessories (especially ones that can be used to watch me sleep at night) are definitely guys i want spitting game at me. i just love man jewelery.
I own the book The Game. And first of all it is not a how-to book (THANK HEAVEN). It is a memoir of a guy who lives for a few years as an apprentice/co-Pick Up Artist with the guy in the picture (His name is Mystery.) If you read the book you'll find that it is more condemning of the lifestyle than you probably think.
And secondly, after you read the book you realize how big of a train wreck Mystery is.
Anywho, it is not a matter of whether or not the moves work, or how "smart" girls are who know what they are. It's the fact of what the guy is looking for with his pick up technique. Usually guys that use this stuff are looking for a quick score. Sorry to be crass but it is true.
And! While I disagree with the intentions of these pick-up artist classes. I do like some of the things that it teaches.
1.) Self Confidence. I see it as it takes a guy with 0 confidence and the class cranks it to 10... which is obnoxious. Then if the guy dials it back ever so slightly he hits the sweet spot.
2.) Self Worth. It also teaches dudes that there are other fish in the sea. If you ask a girl out and she says no? Don't sweat it. There will be others. No need to get all broken up about it. Once again Mystery's classes teach how to have these things to an obnoxious degree. So, if dialed back a little? Back in that sweet spot we talked about.
Talking to guys who take Mystery's classes as if they are the single guys in your marriage/family relations classes or vice versa? Yeah, sorry but doesn't really work. Those are two different animals. They want two entirely different things. Apples and oranges my friend. Apples. And. Oranges.
I know to a woman it can just seem like they are all men. In the academic sense we are. But there are many fundamental differences. This being one of them.
Also, it is a really good, interesting book. It is totally not what you think. I recommend it whole heartedly.
Turns out the axiom of not judging books by their covers still holds true.
Gotta disagree with Tannerama on this one. I read the book [*Totally non-believable disclaimer: I found it at a friend's house (girl) to whom it had been loaned by another friend (guy).] and thought that it was complete trash. What these guys do is not really "picking up girls" but picking up strippers, prostitutes who don't make you pay, and slutty drug addicts with low self esteem.
Granted, there is pretty strong condemnation of the lifestyle, as should be obvious to anyone who reads about Mystery's severe depression and suicidal ideations, but it is pretty strongly glorified as well.
From a literary standpoint, the story is compelling, but I found it difficult to read. There is so much insider lingo that it reads more like an L. Ron Hubbard text than a novel. This was ultimately not worth the time I spent reading it.
Learning self confidence and self worth are great, but I'd turn to Tony Robbins (also highly annoying) before this guy.
Sheesh, if my only options for learning self-confidence and self worth were either Tony Robbins, or this guy, I think I'd have to choose to stay depressed and intimidated.
Yikes, this dude is scary.
haha- stay depressed and intimidated.
Dall- you got something coming in the mail. Don't be scared. You've had this a long-time coming.
Yeah- and didn't Mystery have a history of severe psychological problems and prison or something? I just know it's a history of someone I wouldn't likely get interpersonal communication information from. Try Deborah Tannen- she's a linguist and she's totally legit. "You Just Don't Understand" is an amazing examination of interpersonal communication and understanding other people's styles so you can more effectively communicate by understanding styles that differ from your own. Some may say it's gender oriented, but...read the book- I think it's more than that.
The point of this post was- as my girlfriend and I were laughing at the idea of a book like this-
It is just SO SIMPLE to get a girl's attention. If there is anything men need to know, it's this:
You want us to be interested in you?
Show a little interest in US. Simple as that.
Well that's not ominous or anything. My first instinct was to call your bluff, believing that you couldn't have my address. But that couldn't be too hard to get ahold of, if you're resourceful, which you no doubt are. So I'm not convinced it's a bluff. You've piqued my curiosity now. I'll actually be disappointed if it was a bluff.
Just know that I will be very disturbed if I have something bizarre like severed animal parts, or a lock of your hair, or something like that show up in my mailbox. Very disturbed indeed.
Oh! Why has no one thought of this before? You mean you just have to show interest?
I'm sorry but obviously that can't be the only step or else guys wouldn't have to resort to these kind of theatrics.
This seems like an over-simplification of a super complex process. "How do you render an atomic bomb harmless? You defuse it, silly goose!"
I watched this fellows show and thought he was the master of the obvious. Frankly I thought the guy was a geek and probably wouldn't want to date a girl that couldn't see through his schtick.
However F. you're wrong on one count. It doesn't always take time, especially if the girl is over thirty. My experience is that many (not all mind you) women who fit in the over thirty demographic treat time as an enemy and become rather aggressive. It's almost as if they have switched roles with teenage boys.
Rose
She's on to us men! ABORT! ABORT!
ahhh-haha-
Silly Goose.
You KNOW how much I adore oversimplification! That's the internal gear that makes me (according to my girlfriends), "think like a dude."
Silly Goose!
And trust me, Rosie- it isn't an age thing that makes those women over-agressive. I know young women who are so anxious about "defining" and "progressing" and all that, I wonder at how they even have time to just get to know who they're with and ENJOY that process of getting to know him through dating. Don't you worry, hunny. I'll give them a talking to on that item later.
John/Jake could actually handle a bit of 'toning it town' in the showing interest department.
John/Jake just might want to take advice from Mystery, or Carrot Top, or any male out there -except Captain Awesome.
Hey guys...
Here's some ideas...
1. Call her up consistently
2. Ask her on a date
Repeat steps one and two
Apparently no one knows how to do these TWO F-ING SIMPLE STEPS
Vanilla Vice said...
Hey guys...
Here's some ideas...
1. Call her up consistently
2. Ask her on a date
Repeat steps one and two
What the........?
You mean that can actually work?
What I love about this post is what it says about you. I'm not sure there are many more people out there who are more real than you.
This seems like a very logical and reasonable approach. This should all be completely obvious, but I think where it gets complicated on either side of the equation is that people for the most part don't act logically a lot of the time. Even when we're completely aware of how neurotic we're being/thinking/acting, a lot of times we still can't help ourselves. Although this is probably mostly annoying, sometimes those things make it fun and why it can be so unpredictable and interesting.
O, sweetness.
Well- you are probably right. It may be more of a reflection of my own perspective than anything, but I just want to let the good men out there know:
We DO like you how you are.
We are VERY MUCH attracted to the Nice Guy.
We just need you to actually show us that YOU want US- First.
It doesn't take trickery or moves or smoothness; it just requires sincerity and initiative. Chemistry- well- that's just magic- it's either there or it's not. But any woman worth knowing is going to respect and appreciate you for taking the time to get to know her- even if it is just one date or a few phone calls. And the ones who don't? Trust me, hunny. That's not rejection; that's elimination. Be thankful you don't have to waste time on someone who doesn't appreciate you for who you are and move on to the next interesting woman you meet. And, for the record, Mr Nice Guy, wouldn't you rather know she likes you for you, and not because of some stupid move you read in a book?
Farrah! No! I think every guy and girl should read The Game.
The author is Neil Strauss. Learn about Neil Strauss and you'll find he and Mystery are 2 different people. (Mystery was ONE of his teachers, and became one of his partners, but not his only one.)
Read "The Game". Otherwise you'll be making connections of disconnected things. Either gettting upset or outraged, or glorifying and extoling it as a "how to" is seeing it too generically. We're all (men and women) wiser than that.
Farrah, you are a social person, that is a gift of yours, a gift not every person out there shares. Understand there are those who can't get past social functions/conventions to connect with others and are living a very lonely existence. It doesn't have to do with initiative and sincerity or with calling consistently and asking on dates. Take heart, the hot guys at church of the world aren't poring over this book.
I don't know...the guys who told me about it have all had serious relationships and do quite well for themselves in that department; which is why I say, the need for "tactics" to "get" women?
uhhhh...
Unnecessary. Especially these guys. All it would take is sincerity and consistancy and they could have anyone they wanted. At least for a week or two.
"It is just SO SIMPLE to get a girl's attention. If there is anything men need to know, it's this:
You want us to be interested in you?
Show a little interest in US. Simple as that."
Curiously, this advice is disregarded by women as often as it is by men.
Believe me, there are plenty of women (and men, too)who can't stop talking about themselves, or who don't know how to hold a decent, mature conversation.
Yeah, but that's a different subject altogether.
Are you looking for a more detailed post, Anonymous? I sure wish you had a name. It would help me tailor my approach.
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